um hey. where i live there are no muslims. IM NOT RACIEST but what exactly do muslims believe in? who is allah?

Oy. Where to begin? Let's start with the fact that you obviously mean "racist", but that isn't applicable because Islam is a religion, not a race.

Islam is a monotheistic religion. Muslims believe that there is no God but God. Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, David, Jesus and Muhammad are all considered great prophets. They believe in a Day of Judgment, but do not believe (as Christians do) that someone can atone for another person's sins. They call Jews, Christians and Muslims all "People of the Book". Also unlike Christians, they do not believe in the concept of original sin, but believe that we are all born pure and that we are given a choice between good and evil.

This is, of course, a very brief explication of some basic beliefs. You can read more in this article from the Encyclopaedia Britannica, or do additional research of your own.

"Allah" is the Arabic word for "god".

Wiadomość zmieniona przez autora, lis 3, 2009, 8:41pm.

that is neat but is it true that muslims dont belive in dating white people? is it a sin for them to date white? will they be punished for dating any other race except there own?

*headdesk*

Troll. Ignore it and it will go away.

I agree. This is one of several questions asked by a possible sockpuppet.

what are yall talking about??

Muslims and 'white people' are not mutually exclusive terms.

1
um hey

This happens to be the mantra of my own personal religion. Please do not abuse it.

4
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.

6
a possible sockpuppet
Gee, WHL, you seem to attract a lot of sockpuppets lately, hmmm?

1
Seriously, the site's expert on Islam is a user by the name of oakesspalding. I suggest you approach him with a lengthy and detailed list of questions concerning the faith.

And, Kevin, focus: Muslims are people of all races who practice a certain religion. You were told that in message 2 and you came right back with questions that showed you didn't read the answer.

11
And, Kevin, focus...

What? You don't think he looks focused?

sorry im just a lil slow. im just trying to learn something new. and its hard with this damn college in my way

I was foolishly hoping it was just a "morning after" pic. He's young. There should be hope.

its hard with this damn college in my way

Maybe you could have someone move it for you.

Placing a collage in from of the computer screen is just, well, silly. Why not frame it and mount it on the wall?

funny not when my hands are all oily and greasy from the cars. i work at my college. its fun but it also sux

We call that concept "life".

Oh, I see. It's a vocational "college".

ya and no shit, i no its life. i learned that in jail...

you've really gotten around, haven't you sunshine?

Okay Kevin, so what's the deal here?
It seems that you found this site almost by accident, and you're dumping a lot of poo around the place.

You joined 3 days ago, and haven't cataloged any books (yet). That doesn't make you unique around here (or even a bad person), but it does make me want to question your motivation.

Do you read at all? And, if so, what (generally) do you like to read. If you don't read, then why are you here?

well it depends on how you wanna put that. i took jail for my mom myself and for my friends but i only done that because i love those people and i owed them. i moved several times due to fights. you no its not fun living the way i use to live....

Feel free to catalog anything you might have read in juvvie....

You know - Genet, Burroughs, King James Bible - that kind of thing.

yes i do read. im into horror and to be honest this aint my computer it belongs to the college so if i do lot of non college lookups on here then the college will take the computer back. so if i look up books and stuff all that goes on my history and if they see all the book lookups then they will take up my computer. and i dont want that.

this aint my computer it belongs to the college

Is it right there in the grease pit, or is it out in the hall near the coke machine?

what do u mean?? there can be any where but if it gets messed up then i got to pay 1100 dollars. this is a mackbook

Kevin. Ignore those assholes, they give reading and education a bad name.

The only stupid question is the one that doesn't get asked. So don't let these pricks put you down.

First, of course most muslims also happen to be of asian descent, so it appears to be a religion associated with race. However it doesn't follow that it's a racist religion. The Koran (the book of Islam) doesn't tell Muslims that they shouldn't associate with people of another race, although it does, like every religion including Christianity and Judaism, argue forcefully that the followers of this particular religion are going to have a better life and afterlife than those that don't believe.

Second. So according to the religion, it isn't a sin to date a person of a different race, but they might not be so happy about a Muslim dating a non-Muslim.

Third, as with every community, there are always some racists. There are white-Christian racists that think Christians/whites shouldn't associate with/date black or asian people, and its similar with some Muslims. As you know, Christians can be black or white. It's the same with Muslims.

So a Muslim might be punished for dating a white, but that's because there are some racist Muslims, just as there are racist Christians.

Fundamentalist Jewish communities believe that no Jew can marry anyone whose mother is not Jewish, so there is an ethnically conservative definition in some versions of Judaism. However, again, this is not true for all Jews.

Edit: To be fair, the last point was too harsh. 'Some' fundamentalist Jewish communities think this way. 'Fundamentalist' here is a little too vague, and is not meant to mean simply 'orthodox'. The general point remains the same, all of these three religions can be misinterpreted according to racist prejudices, whether by those who profess the faith or those who oppose it.

Wiadomość zmieniona przez autora, lis 9, 2009, 6:43am.

For those new to the site, it might be useful to review the TOS regarding sockpuppetry.

Makifat

For those that have been using the site for a long time, it might be a good idea to be more welcoming to those that don't know their way around the site. Quite apart from the fact that snide and patronising comments towards those with less experience than yourself is effectively bullying. Clearly you don't know any better.

@kevintherealist: http://tinyurl.com/yal2r2l

31

Quite apart from the fact that snide and patronising comments towards those with less experience than yourself is effectively bullying.

Yeah, the "prick" and "asshole" comments are evidence that you are pretty well familiar with the social niceties.

Boys! You're ruining my popcorn time!

Not you, funkyderek, you get a high five for showing me my new favorite website.

If you will look around a bit at kevin's various threads, I think you will find that I have been patient, kind and forbearing. I have not bullied or patronized.

I lost patience when he didn't bother read the answer to the question he asked. I sincerely beg pardon. I tried to make sure he got the answer by stating it more simply and more clearly. If that is snide, I'm sorry again. I do try to be giving on this site, but I expect a modicum of giving to come back my way.

"those that have been using the site for a long time" tend to be fairly good at spotting a put-on or a sockpuppet. A joke is a proper response to a joke. You may notice that "kevintherealist" doesn't seem to be too bent out of shape over it.

>#36: well, he is a realist.

Sadly, Makifat, you really were asking for trouble and transgressed the social niceties when you started trying to make fun of the kid. Kevintherealist was simply asking straightforward questions.

MerryMary, I didn't regard your comments as snide or patronising. If I appeared to be aiming my comments at you then I apologise. Your comments were almost sweet! Makifat, on the other hand, was right to feel that my colourful language was apt to be about him. Although I'm surprised that any fan of Rimbaud would find himself unable to stomach the rich flavour of the metaphor.

Anyway. I'm off. Talk among yourselves.

Trouble is my middle name.

Hmmm ... It looks like TC was referencing himself in #28.

If I seemed harsh to Kevin, that was not my intention.

well thanks for the heads up. just if u wanna talk behind my back thats kewl but i bet no one will say nuttin to my face. thats off the subject. but ya i no there trying to give me a hard time.

Ta wiadomość została oznaczona flagą przez wielu użytkowników i nie jest już wyświetlana.

I find it also interesting that TC joined TODAY...

Sorry, I smell sock puppetry.

Kevin, nobody is going to talk behind your back. Well, we could if we were to send private messages to each other, but really, I doubt that anyone would be interested. It just seemed a bit odd and inappropriate for someone to ~just~ join and post things like you did in #3.

ETA: Really, that language is uncalled for. No one is "against" you. You are, however, not making any friends here, though.

Wiadomość zmieniona przez autora, lis 4, 2009, 9:30pm.

oh ok. i get the muslim thing no thanks Third_Cheek. i got a song thats im muslim they say theres no english but there is. but idk maybe some of our words are theres to.

i dont give a fuck if it was it was inappropriate i wanted to so i put it on there. do u got a problem with that??? huh?

Okay, bye!

Curiously, Third cheek also saw fit to change his username a couple of hours ago. Can't say the new name is much of an improvement...

Bogus or not, this thread is officially a waste of time...

No matter. I've got a sneaking suspicion that kevin will be going away soon.

Wiadomość zmieniona przez autora, lis 4, 2009, 9:39pm.

tell me bout it its wasing my time. but i gota stay occupied some how

but i gota stay occupied some how

Well, since you have internet access and an unquenchable thirst for knowledge....

this computer is suppost to be for college use only if i use it alot for anything else then i wil get it taken up. so all i do is use this website and the college website

is anybody still on?

Maybe you could start some threads about politics. That would be fun.

>#52: off and on. People come and go here, it's not like a chat room. There can sometimes be a long delay between people posting. Extremely long, if there is any swearing or threatening posts.

> 28

First, of course most muslims also happen to be of asian descent

First, of course, Islam arose in the Middle East, where the people are Semitic, not Asian.

Wiadomość zmieniona przez autora, lis 4, 2009, 11:53pm.

>#55: yeah, i was wondering about that too. But, assuming that you refer to both Pakistan and Indonesia as Asian, would that statement not be factually correct, if still somewhat misleading?

Not an expert but: in Islam religion is the binding factor, not race. It would be sinful for one muslim to consider him/herself more worthy than any other muslim based on race. And since Islam is found amongst all races, dating a person of another race would - in that respect - be perfectly fine.

This does not mean that there are no muslims who also have racist ideas. Or that the culture of some muslims might be against the very concept of dating. And dating "non-believers" might also be a problem.

And yes, numerically most muslims are asian (Indonesia, Pakistan). But first of all you couldn't reverse that statement - Islam is only a minority religion in the most populous Asian countries (China, India). And second: Islam is also very much alive in Africa for instance.

Wiadomość zmieniona przez autora, lis 5, 2009, 4:20am.

Also, just to correct the post in 28 (why am I bothering? Maybe my headache medicine?):

It is true that, strictly speaking, someone is Jewish if their mother is Jewish. However, it is possible to convert to Judaism with the appropriate study and "certification". Therefore, although most people who are Jewish are racially similar, there are people who are "certifiably Jewish" of different races.

The appeal of Islam in the U.S. has been, in part I believe, the fact that it IS a religion of all races. I remember reading The autobiography of Malcolm X so long ago. He describes going to Mecca and seeing how Muslims were of so many different colors. It actually started him along a path of forgiveness of the oppressive white culture in this country and a new philosophy about how people can live together, which seemingly is what got him killed.

k4k

ETA: The fact that there are some people in each faith who choose to use their religion as a weapon against others is something that religion itself seems powerless to prevent.

Wiadomość zmieniona przez autora, lis 5, 2009, 3:59pm.

55/56: It appears that only about 20% of the world's Muslims live in the Middle East -- the majority are in Asia and the Pacific. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cou...

58: I have the impression that most Muslims would regard Malcolm X and the Nation of Islam as a separate religion outside of Islam, much in the same way that many Christians would consider Mormonism a separate religion. Not being a Muslim myself, I could be wrong on this point.

59:

True, but there are people who follow Islam here that do not belong to the Nation of Islam. I think the Nation of Islam actually has a more racially divisive message, which is why Malcolm X partly disassociated himself from them.

Divisions occur even among those more closely related. Observe Sunni vs. Shia, Protestants vs. Catholics in Northern Ireland etc.

Well thanks all for confirming that I was correct in my delivery of the facts to Kevintherealist. I'm very disappointed by the way he was treated, having only just arrived on the site myself.

I'll agree that the language I used was too strong, but I won't accept that there wasn't a little bullying/belittling of KTR going on when I arrived.

The questions he asked might have been better directed elsewhere, but they appeared to be straightforward questions requiring a straightforward answer rather than smirking and condescension.

There seems to be some paranoia about so called 'sockpuppetry' all over this site, and as far as I can tell this follows a recent post from Tim regarding the abuse of multiple identities on the site. I changed my own sign-in name because I was afraid of being the recipient of abuse after having made my complaint. I had previously been known as 'werkmeister'.

Of course, now that I'm also a suspect in this paranoid 'sockpuppet' witchhunt, everything I post is immediately considered suspect too. For example, my statement that most Muslims are of Asian descent. Which is entirely correct, as those who checked have confirmed. Those who immediately considered this a suspect claim ought to be ashamed of their ignorance. Perhaps you thought that most Muslims are from the Middle East. Well no actually. As to the apparent inaccuracy in my assertion that 'there is a racial definition in *some* versions of Judaism', it is true. Perhaps you wanted to take issue with the word 'so' that preceded that statement, but now if that's the complaint against my post then it is really too pedantic given the context. You'll notice that I was claiming that there are potentially racist positions within each of those religions, but also that the religions are not therefore racist. Again this is correct, and to my mind very fair. If someone asks you a question about racism or other discrimination on the part of Muslims, then one ought to make it clear that the same accusations can also be brought to bear against other religions.

In sum, having read as far as >26 and seeing the way in which the kid was being pissed around with arrogant, elitist and patronising remarks, especially from one particular member, and including jokes which the tellers knew he would not also understand ("Genet, Burroughs..."), I decided someone should stick up for the kid and then answer the questions in a straightforward manner. The kid admitted he didn't read much. He's obviously had a tough life. If someone comes online with a simple question on a serious topic, then one should answer the questions or go to another thread.

Anyone brave enough to ask serious questions should be helped with finding the answers.

Simple.

That's what I did, and I'm sorry if that upset those who really should have known better.

wow alot said i was there. i just want to thank u for standing up 4 me and answering my question. and yes i did have a hard life like i said b4 i spent most of it in jail so all i could do was red the bible.

No problem. And don't be put off posting your own thread/question again. You'll probably find that most people on this site will give you a useful answer straight away. If they aren't interested in the question then they shouldn't reply at all. The most productive question you might try asking would be something like "I'm really interested in books about ....... does anyone have any suggestions?" (Fill in the missing word!) Try setting up a new discussion with that and see what happens.

Wiadomość zmieniona przez autora, lis 8, 2009, 7:53pm.

>#61: I'm also a suspect in this paranoid 'sockpuppet' witchhunt...

Please tell the Committee: Are you now or have you ever been a sockpuppet?*

*Note: Joke**

**Note: when you have to say something is a joke, you should know better than to say the joke in the first place.***

***Note: I know better, but sometimes i can't help myself.

"Enough already!" (spoken through a smile)

kevintherealist, I note from your profile page that you hail from East Texas - Atlanta, to be precise. It may surprise you to know that I am not unacquainted with that area. In fact, some quick mental calculations reveal that it is entirely possible that I was in the vicinity on or around your general time of conception. Not that that has any bearing on anything.

I was meeting up with a local colleague, and he was taking me on a driving tour. To break the ice, I decided to take the joke card out of my wallet and show him my “pride and joy”. The effect was more dramatic than I had expected, and the old fellow went into such paroxysms of laughter that he drove the car clean off the lonely road and into a ditch. Night was falling in the piney woods, and we had a hell of a time getting the car out. To make matters worse, my companion was going into an increasing panic at the thought that, in his wanderings, he might actually have driven us into Arkansas! I wasn’t sure the reason for his apprehension - maybe he was just concerned about being caught out in the woods after dusk with a somewhat swarthy out-of-towner who read Genet. Or maybe the bogey creek monster was more than just a rumor. Whatever his concerns, we managed to extricate the car from the ditch, set our bearings for the setting sun, and haul ass out of Arkansas.

We got to Texarkana. My companion dropped me at my motel. I cleaned up and went looking for a stiff drink. The desk clerk informed me that, being on the dividing line between Texas and dreaded Arkansas, the street we were on was “wet” on one side and “dry” on the other. I forget which was which, but I found my way to a steakhouse with an adequately stocked bar and a (to put it kindly) vintage cocktail waitress, and toasted myself on a disaster averted.

I also picked up my first (and only, thank God) tick in East Texas, an ugly and embarrassing episode. But that’s a story for another time…

bonita historia..

gracias.

es verdad!

si

Que??

Note: there is a group here on LibraryThing devoted to Islamic topics, books, etc. (Oddly enough, it's called ISLAM.)

> 10 You are mischief incarnate. :)